Email Program Interface POP3 or What?

[billwilson]

I believe there are two ways to link a PC-based email program to a web based email server. I have always used POP3 but I need to learn more about the other alternative. I can't remember the name of the alternative! I want to look for a tutorial where I can learn the characteristics of that method.

Thanks,
Bill

[n5bb]

Welcome to the EMD Forums, Bill!

You posted in the Fastmail Help forum. Do you have a Fastmail account? If so, there are several different ways you can access your email (read and send messages):

• Webmail: You can use nearly any web browser and access Fastmail at https://www.fastmail.fm - In this case, the interaction between your PC or mobile device and the Fastmail system is all over SSL (secure) https web pages, just as with any other secure website connection. The latest version of the Fastmail interface (for either a mobile device or desktop computer) gives you instant delivery of new emails which arrive while you are connected. You also use the webmail system to send email.
• POP (now POP3): This standard started over 25 years ago, when computer connections to houses were usually with dial-up modems and short connections (due to time metered access fees). POP is just a way to allow incoming messages to be temporarily stored on an email server, then downloaded as a group to your POP email client running on your PC. Initially all messages were deleted from the server after you downloaded them, since the servers had small memory storage quotas. Eventually the storage size increased, and POP3 email clients usually have a setting to allow messages to be saved on the server unless they are specifically delete. But you essentially have one Inbox folder on the server which holds messages for you, which are later dumped onto your POP3 PC client.
• IMAP: This is a more advanced standard for reading email. There is a long-term connection allowed to the email server, and you can move message back and forth between folders on the email server and folders on your local PC email client. IMAP tends to be more reliable than POP and allows instant delivery of new messages which they arrive (using the IDLE feature). However, many mobile devices don't support IDLE due to power consumption issues.
• SMTP: This is a standard for sending email if you are using a local POP or IMAP email client.

In the case of all of these systems (webmail, POP3, IMAP, and SMTP) your computer is communicating using either a web browser or email client program to the Fastmail server. Your computer doesn't directly send message to a destination PC - instead, your computer sends the message to the Fastmail server using webmail or SMTP, then another Fastmail server connects to a destination service server (such as Gmail) and delivers the message to that destination server. If someone is logged into the Gmail server via webmail or an IMAP email client, they will receive that email nearly instantly (usually within 10 seconds or so). Some email services (such as Yahoo and many others) have significant sending and receiving delays, and it may take up to a couple of minutes to deliver a message.

I hope that helps. Sorry for the long discussion!

Bill

[billwilson]

Thanks for the very thorough explanation, Bill. Yes, I have had a FastMail account for many years and now I know that the name that I had forgotten is IMAP! The only name that would come to mind was "MAPI" and after reading a little about that I knew it was not what I was looking for.

I have a lot of questions about how it works from the user's perspective so I'll do some Google searches and see what I can find. I need to transition my wife from a POP environment on a pretty old PC to something more modern and she is very not-computer oriented. She tried the webmail approach on FastMail and didn't like it so I'm going to look at this.

Thanks for your help.
Bill

[Cory]

The transition to IMAP is an awesome one! Whenever I can I transition users of mine who are on POP to IMAP every single one of them is always wowed and in love when there email is the same on webmail and on their computer (especially when they bring a tablet or laptop into the mix with their desktop).

Also Fastmail I've heard has a fast IMAP server so it shouldn't be much of a noticeable difference in terms of speed.

-Cory

[BritTim]

The number one thing to stress to anyone used to POP3 who is switching to IMAP is this:
When using POP3, deleting or moving messages on the desktop has no effect on the copy of messages on the server. With IMAP, deleting or moving messages is operating on the messages on the server.
For some people, this is easily understood, and it is a huge advantage when using email on multiple devices (such as computer, tablet and phone). However, some people have become used to the idea that messages are on the server so can be deleted from the computer or phone. Especially if your wife is not computer savvy, be careful.

[billwilson]

Thanks Croy & BritTim for your information a few days ago. I've been searching for user-interface information on IMAP and I've found some but I still have some questions. I think I'll compile a list of questions and then post them in a new message with IMAP in the title line.

Thanks for your help.
Bill

[William9]

In addition to Bill's (n5bb) excellent description of IMAP and POP above, here is a link to a concise tabular comparison.
https://kb.wisc.edu/cae/page.php?id=6782

[billwilson]

Thanks William9, that helps a little. I've also read the FastMail IMAP Help example (https://www.fastmail.fm/docs/imap/im...geexample.html) and it answered several of my questions. I still have a couple of questions so I'll ask them right here and see what happens:

1. While using the IMAP client off-line to read messages that had been retrieved earlier, If I delete a message on the client will it be automatically deleted on the server the next time the folder is synchronized? Or, does the synchronizing work in only one direction: server to client?

2. While using the client off-line, if I move a message from say the Inbox to another existing folder, is this move made on the server the next time the two folders are synchronized?

3. This investigation is for my wife's email which has a lot of messages in the Inbox and a few other folders, and she is not willing to give them up and start over. All her messages are in her email client and none are in her FastMail server account. I am getting her a new PC to replace her very old WinXP machine and I'm thinking I'll make this transition to IMAP at that time. What would be a good approach to use to convert her existing email to IMAP?

Thanks,
Bill

[Adrian Bell]

1. Yes, the synchronisation works both ways.

2. Yes, as long as the folder is a folder on the server (ie. not a local folder).

3. You could set up the IMAP account on the existing PC, then copy the local folder structure to the server and move (or copy) the messages to the server. You could then just set up the IMAP account on the new PC and everything will be there. Of course you are, and always will be, limited by the applicable storage quota. This is also something to think about, although you can also move messages to local folders in order to free up space. If you don't use this approach you will need to transfer any local messages to the new PC otherwise they will be lost, the method will depend on which email client she is using now, and which client is to be used on the new PC.

a) What storage quota does she have?
b) Which client is she using now?
c) Which client is planned for future use?

[billwilson]

Adrian, thanks for the great info. That is very encouraging. Here are the answers to your questions:

a) She currently has a quote of 1 GB.
b) She is currently using Windows Live Mail.
c) I plan to get a Windows 8 laptop for her and the email client is an open question. I use Thunderbird on my laptop and I will have to decide what to use for her. I don't know what is available on Win8. Do you have a suggestion or recommendation?

She currently has about 4 GB of messages stored and it looks like we can accommodate that by moving up to the next higher subscription quota. I have a couple more questions:

1. If I set up the folder structures on the PC and FastMail so they match and then I switch the current Live Mail account to IMAP, if that is possible, wouldn't a synchronize between the two take care of copying all the messages up to the server?

2. She also has an Android tablet. Is there an email app for Android that supports IMAP? I imagine there probably is. I have tried several in POP mode but haven't thought about IMAP before.

Thanks for the great reply to my questions.
Bill

[lane]

1. You can't take an account in Windows Live Mail which is set up as POP and change it to IMAP. What you do is create a second account in WLM which is IMAP, create the folders you want, and copy the messages from the POP account to the IMAP one. When you are satisfied that the messages copied OK, you can remove the original POP account if you like.
2. I recommend copying the messages in chunks rather than all 4 GB at once. Once you have all the messages satisfactorily copied to the account and accessible by IMAP, you can consider switching clients. WLM works well on Windows 8, as does Thunderbird. There is a minimalist client also as a pure "WIndows 8 app".
3. The built-in Android app works fine for me with IMAP, but there are others as well.

If you are using the same actual Fastmail account, be sure to switch off the POP polling of the account, or at least do not allow it to remove messages from the server.

[Adrian Bell]

1. I would go to the properties of the POP account and uncheck the box to include this account when synchronising. This should ensure that the messages stay on the server. If you then set up a new IMAP account, you should then get a fresh set of folders. These will be the folders on the server. You will then be able to replicate the local folder structure on the server (so that you have the same folders on both). You can then start copying (safer than moving) the messages to the server. This could take a long time though as your ISP's upload speed will be considerably less than their download speed. I would only do so many at once. You may also need to watch the Fastmail Hourly/daily transfer quota.

2. Nearly all Android mail apps support IMAP, as there were designed for mobile phones with little local storage available. The standard Android mail app supports IMAP, but it sets its own folders for sent, drafts, trash etc. so if they are not spelled exactly the same you end up with two sets of everything (ie. both Sent & Sent Items). Later versions may have improved though? K9 lets you set your own to match Fastmail's, although it is a bit fiddly to set up. There are also other options which I have not tried.

<edit>lane beat me to it</edit>

[billwilson]

Thanks lane and Adrian, I think I am all set now. I'm going to change my FastMail email to IMAP first and then after I am satisfied that I understand it all I'll work on my wife's. My email isn't nearly as large as hers so I believe it will fit into my present FastMail account.

Thanks for all your help.
Bill