Compose screen message options?

hadaso · 31 Jul 2016, 07:30 AM

I am currently using both the classic and the new web interfaces in different tabs. The new interface because it is superior in many respects, and the classic because it has some essentiial functionality the the new interface seems to completely lack, expecially in composing email.

The classic interface compose screen has a "message options" section That I don't see in the new compose screen. The only functionality I really need from this section is the "Save Copy" menu that allows one to choose the folder where the sent message will be filed. In the new interface Icannot find this option, and it forces me to have to chase the message to whereever it is automatically filed and move it to where I really want it to be filed (actually it forces me to go and compose in the classic interface, because I hate it that pressing the "send" button doesn't mean I'm done with this message. I like to set everything and the click "send" and forget about it).

I know it can be hacked by duplicating each personality with all the folders Iuse to file email related to it, but I don't want to have so many personalities that are not really different personalities.

Is this option hidden somewhere or is it inexistent (for a long time I used to go to the classic interfaceto strip attachments off messages until one day discovvered the functionality is available in the new interface, only hidden until you select an attachment. I wonder what else is there but hidden).

Back to the compose screen, there are some other issues with it that keep sending me back to the classic compose screen:

The toolbar has no subscript/superscript buttons.
No source html editing.
ctrl+[ and ctrl+] are grabbed by the screen (they are part of the Hebrew keyboard in Windows, used to type the Unicode LRM and RLM characters).
The classic inteface allows four differerent quoting styles. I use almost all of them (most often quoted plain text, to erase all existing markup, and then I switch to html editing, but I can probably live with less options).

So I would really like to know if some of these problems have solutions.

And while I'm at it: in the android app, it seems that composition (at least in my settings) is in html mode, but I see no way to apply any formatting. I almost never use the app for composing, because I need at least a way to mark Hebrew text as right to left, or else it may be garbled, and the punctuation would not be placed correctly. I would very muchlike to find out haw to apply some formatting to composed mail in the app, because otherwise it is useless for more than short half sentence replies (or replies in English, but most of my correspondence is local).

n5bb · 31 Jul 2016, 09:50 AM

Glad to see you back on EMD, hadaso!

I think that FastMail assumes that most customers will use the "group messages in conversations" and improved search features to find messages, so that filing in folders is not as important. I auto-file most incoming business and other non-personal messages into folders with rules or subdomain addressing, but I often just let replies stay in the Sent folder, since I the messages will be grouped together and I can find them anyway with a search. I understand your pain, but saving every message in a particular folder takes a lot of work, so getting away from that strict routine puts less pressure on me when I'm responding to messages.
As long as I can search later for messages there isn't any functionality lost as far as I'm concerned.

FastMail has added a large number of keyboard shortcut commands, and the ones for the Compose screen may be sufficient for you. See:
https://www.fastmail.com/help/receiv...s.html#compose

Bill

NJSS · 31 Jul 2016, 04:05 PM

Good to see you again hadaso.

NJSS

B4its2L8 · 31 Jul 2016, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hadaso

No source html editing.

I miss that in the new interface, too.

Terry · 31 Jul 2016, 07:30 PM

A lot of good bits have been left out...BUT...we now have 2 clicks to log out....god help us if that is progress.

NumberSix · 1 Aug 2016, 06:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hadaso

I know it can be hacked by duplicating each personality with all the folders Iuse to file email related to it, but I don't want to have so many personalities that are not really different personalities.

Clearly you have a well-designed workflow that does not align with the new(er) web client

This is an option that I also had thought was valuable, and should not have been eliminated, until I discovered that for most people's workflows, putting the sent-save folder into the personality would work just fine. For mine too.

But I thought Bill's response above was good, and apropos to your concern. So... on the one hand, maybe FM cannot continue to accomodate every single person's workflow by maintaining certain power-features, if they have offered equivalently powerful though different options, but on the OTHER, I also have never understood why features like this cannot remain hidden for most people, to be revealed only when one checks a "Show advanced controls" checkbox in the advanced settings screen (presumably ignored by those who wouldn't use them

)

hadaso · 1 Aug 2016, 07:52 AM

This is not just a little feature gone.
In the past one of the main reasons to join FastMail was that it allowed consolidating all your mail in one place.
So I have one account with many folders and subfolders, and several personalities using different addresses.

I use it for work and for communicating with family and friends. I used it simultaeneously with several employers, and I needed the emails relationg to different employers comletely separate. Currently I work for only one employer, but I certainly have to keep work email separate from union email (I use a separate address and pesonality and separate folders for union correspondence).

So I need at least to separate email belobging to different roles to something resembling separate email accounts.

With work email I separate emails to folders "by topic". There's no way I could find email if I file everything together. Email searches can only find what's explicitly written in the email (and not in attachments). It cannot know the context, and filing provides that. I could use less folders if there was some way to add labels or keywords to email, but currently the only way to put it in context is to use several folders. (I know no other other way to search for an email with no subject that says "please read the attached document and comment"). Filing email is not that much effort in both interfaces, except for filing sent mail in the new interface.

As for threaded view. I disabled it several years ago, because I couldn't figure how to file each message in its appropriate folder, and not the whole conversation. It was mixing unrelated emails, because many people always compose by replying to an old irrelevant email unstead of starting a new conversations.

Perhaps when I retire I would only need one folder. But then I would not need a "Sent Items" folder. Actually I don't see the point in filing sent mail and received mail in different folders. I can easily separate them by searching for myself as the sender.

gardenweed · 1 Aug 2016, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hadaso

I know it can be hacked by duplicating each personality with all the folders Iuse to file email related to it, but I don't want to have so many personalities that are not really different personalities.

The method you describe as a hack is what I use.

Every time I start a new job, I create a new folder, a new personality, & a new template.
All sent and received mail on that job go into that single folder.

I have a lot of personalities (of the Fastmail variety).
They only way they differ is in their nickname and the "Save to:" folder.
Every other aspect is identical.

It's a nuisance compared to the Classic interface method.
But that's what I have done to deal with it.

hadaso · 6 Oct 2016, 07:20 AM

An idea that occured to me: putting that functionality (where to file a copy of the sent message) in the "message options" section was conceptually wrong. Business memos (of the good old paper type) often has a list of "cc" recipient, and often some of these "recipients" are not actually recipients but rather archives of files where copies of the memo are to be filed. Filing a copy of an outgoing email message in the "Sent items" folder or any other folder is the same sort of thing. So it seems to me that the "correct" way to think of this is that the "Sent items" folder (or another folder designated in a pesonality/identity explicitly in the "message options" section in the classic interface) is a bcc recipient that receives a copy of the email. So "morally" it should have been in the "to/cc/bcc" section in the classic interface (I think it was in that area of the screen in the very old FM webmail client more than 10 years ago).

This probably mean that it may be possible for me to "hack" the functionality in the new interface by sending myself a bcc copy and using Sieve to file it where I want it. But it would be a pain and prone to errors compared to selecting a folder from a dropdown menu in the classic interface.

BritTim · 6 Oct 2016, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hadaso

An idea that occured to me: putting that functionality (where to file a copy of the sent message) in the "message options" section was conceptually wrong. Business memos (of the good old paper type) often has a list of "cc" recipient, and often some of these "recipients" are not actually recipients but rather archives of files where copies of the memo are to be filed. Filing a copy of an outgoing email message in the "Sent items" folder or any other folder is the same sort of thing. So it seems to me that the "correct" way to think of this is that the "Sent items" folder (or another folder designated in a pesonality/identity explicitly in the "message options" section in the classic interface) is a bcc recipient that receives a copy of the email. So "morally" it should have been in the "to/cc/bcc" section in the classic interface (I think it was in that area of the screen in the very old FM webmail client more than 10 years ago).

This probably mean that it may be possible for me to "hack" the functionality in the new interface by sending myself a bcc copy and using Sieve to file it where I want it. But it would be a pain and prone to errors compared to selecting a folder from a dropdown menu in the classic interface.

The way I deal with this is to have multiple Identities for the same sending address which file the outgoing messages in different folders.

31 Jul 2016, 07:30 AM	#1
hadaso The "e" in e-mail Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Holon, Israel. Posts: 4,853	Compose screen message options? I am currently using both the classic and the new web interfaces in different tabs. The new interface because it is superior in many respects, and the classic because it has some essentiial functionality the the new interface seems to completely lack, expecially in composing email. The classic interface compose screen has a "message options" section That I don't see in the new compose screen. The only functionality I really need from this section is the "Save Copy" menu that allows one to choose the folder where the sent message will be filed. In the new interface Icannot find this option, and it forces me to have to chase the message to whereever it is automatically filed and move it to where I really want it to be filed (actually it forces me to go and compose in the classic interface, because I hate it that pressing the "send" button doesn't mean I'm done with this message. I like to set everything and the click "send" and forget about it). I know it can be hacked by duplicating each personality with all the folders Iuse to file email related to it, but I don't want to have so many personalities that are not really different personalities. Is this option hidden somewhere or is it inexistent (for a long time I used to go to the classic interfaceto strip attachments off messages until one day discovvered the functionality is available in the new interface, only hidden until you select an attachment. I wonder what else is there but hidden). Back to the compose screen, there are some other issues with it that keep sending me back to the classic compose screen: The toolbar has no subscript/superscript buttons. No source html editing. ctrl+[ and ctrl+] are grabbed by the screen (they are part of the Hebrew keyboard in Windows, used to type the Unicode LRM and RLM characters). The classic inteface allows four differerent quoting styles. I use almost all of them (most often quoted plain text, to erase all existing markup, and then I switch to html editing, but I can probably live with less options). So I would really like to know if some of these problems have solutions. And while I'm at it: in the android app, it seems that composition (at least in my settings) is in html mode, but I see no way to apply any formatting. I almost never use the app for composing, because I need at least a way to mark Hebrew text as right to left, or else it may be garbled, and the punctuation would not be placed correctly. I would very muchlike to find out haw to apply some formatting to composed mail in the app, because otherwise it is useless for more than short half sentence replies (or replies in English, but most of my correspondence is local).

31 Jul 2016, 09:50 AM	#2
n5bb Intergalactic Postmaster Join Date: May 2004 Location: Irving, Texas Posts: 8,929	Glad to see you back on EMD, hadaso! I think that FastMail assumes that most customers will use the "group messages in conversations" and improved search features to find messages, so that filing in folders is not as important. I auto-file most incoming business and other non-personal messages into folders with rules or subdomain addressing, but I often just let replies stay in the Sent folder, since I the messages will be grouped together and I can find them anyway with a search. I understand your pain, but saving every message in a particular folder takes a lot of work, so getting away from that strict routine puts less pressure on me when I'm responding to messages. As long as I can search later for messages there isn't any functionality lost as far as I'm concerned. FastMail has added a large number of keyboard shortcut commands, and the ones for the Compose screen may be sufficient for you. See: https://www.fastmail.com/help/receiv...s.html#compose Bill

31 Jul 2016, 04:05 PM	#3
NJSS Master of the @ Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Hampshire, UK Posts: 1,238	Good to see you again hadaso. NJSS

31 Jul 2016, 07:30 PM	#5
Terry The "e" in e-mail Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: VK4 Posts: 3,028	A lot of good bits have been left out...BUT...we now have 2 clicks to log out....god help us if that is progress.

1 Aug 2016, 07:52 AM	#7
hadaso The "e" in e-mail Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Holon, Israel. Posts: 4,853	This is not just a little feature gone. In the past one of the main reasons to join FastMail was that it allowed consolidating all your mail in one place. So I have one account with many folders and subfolders, and several personalities using different addresses. I use it for work and for communicating with family and friends. I used it simultaeneously with several employers, and I needed the emails relationg to different employers comletely separate. Currently I work for only one employer, but I certainly have to keep work email separate from union email (I use a separate address and pesonality and separate folders for union correspondence). So I need at least to separate email belobging to different roles to something resembling separate email accounts. With work email I separate emails to folders "by topic". There's no way I could find email if I file everything together. Email searches can only find what's explicitly written in the email (and not in attachments). It cannot know the context, and filing provides that. I could use less folders if there was some way to add labels or keywords to email, but currently the only way to put it in context is to use several folders. (I know no other other way to search for an email with no subject that says "please read the attached document and comment"). Filing email is not that much effort in both interfaces, except for filing sent mail in the new interface. As for threaded view. I disabled it several years ago, because I couldn't figure how to file each message in its appropriate folder, and not the whole conversation. It was mixing unrelated emails, because many people always compose by replying to an old irrelevant email unstead of starting a new conversations. Perhaps when I retire I would only need one folder. But then I would not need a "Sent Items" folder. Actually I don't see the point in filing sent mail and received mail in different folders. I can easily separate them by searching for myself as the sender.

6 Oct 2016, 07:20 AM	#9
hadaso The "e" in e-mail Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Holon, Israel. Posts: 4,853	An idea that occured to me: putting that functionality (where to file a copy of the sent message) in the "message options" section was conceptually wrong. Business memos (of the good old paper type) often has a list of "cc" recipient, and often some of these "recipients" are not actually recipients but rather archives of files where copies of the memo are to be filed. Filing a copy of an outgoing email message in the "Sent items" folder or any other folder is the same sort of thing. So it seems to me that the "correct" way to think of this is that the "Sent items" folder (or another folder designated in a pesonality/identity explicitly in the "message options" section in the classic interface) is a bcc recipient that receives a copy of the email. So "morally" it should have been in the "to/cc/bcc" section in the classic interface (I think it was in that area of the screen in the very old FM webmail client more than 10 years ago). This probably mean that it may be possible for me to "hack" the functionality in the new interface by sending myself a bcc copy and using Sieve to file it where I want it. But it would be a pain and prone to errors compared to selecting a folder from a dropdown menu in the classic interface.